diff --git a/libs/ardour/ardour/control_group.h b/libs/ardour/ardour/control_group.h
index 712bb792aa..d0afc185e2 100644
--- a/libs/ardour/ardour/control_group.h
+++ b/libs/ardour/ardour/control_group.h
@@ -35,6 +35,8 @@
 namespace ARDOUR {
 
 class CoreSelection;
+class RouteGroup;
+class Stripable;
 
 class LIBARDOUR_API ControlGroup : public std::enable_shared_from_this<ControlGroup>
 {
@@ -47,7 +49,7 @@ class LIBARDOUR_API ControlGroup : public std::enable_shared_from_this<ControlGr
 		Inverted = 0x2,
 	};
 
-	void fill_from_selection (CoreSelection const &, Evoral::Parameter const &);
+	void fill_from_selection_or_group (std::shared_ptr<Stripable>, CoreSelection const &, Evoral::Parameter const &, bool (RouteGroup::*group_predicate)() const);
 
 	int add_control (std::shared_ptr<AutomationControl>, bool push = false);
 	int remove_control (std::shared_ptr<AutomationControl>, bool pop = false);
diff --git a/libs/ardour/ardour/selection.h b/libs/ardour/ardour/selection.h
index 3c1dc21670..599102291e 100644
--- a/libs/ardour/ardour/selection.h
+++ b/libs/ardour/ardour/selection.h
@@ -73,6 +73,8 @@ class LIBARDOUR_API CoreSelection : public PBD::Stateful {
 	typedef std::vector<StripableAutomationControl> StripableAutomationControls;
 
 	void get_stripables (StripableAutomationControls&) const;
+	void get_stripables_for_op (StripableList&, std::shared_ptr<Stripable> base, bool (RouteGroup::*group_predicate)() const) const;
+	void get_stripables_for_op (std::shared_ptr<StripableList>, std::shared_ptr<Stripable> base, bool (RouteGroup::*group_predicate)() const) const;
 
 	XMLNode& get_state () const;
 	int set_state (const XMLNode&, int version);
diff --git a/libs/ardour/ardour/solo_mute_release.h b/libs/ardour/ardour/solo_mute_release.h
index fea7d197b6..c8b1596936 100644
--- a/libs/ardour/ardour/solo_mute_release.h
+++ b/libs/ardour/ardour/solo_mute_release.h
@@ -38,9 +38,9 @@ public:
 
 	void set_exclusive (bool exclusive = true);
 
-	void set (std::shared_ptr<Route>);
-	void set (std::shared_ptr<RouteList const>);
-	void set (std::shared_ptr<RouteList const>, std::shared_ptr<RouteList const>);
+	void set (std::shared_ptr<Stripable>);
+	void set (std::shared_ptr<StripableList const>);
+	void set (std::shared_ptr<StripableList const>, std::shared_ptr<StripableList const>);
 	void set (std::shared_ptr<std::list<std::string> >);
 
 	void release (Session*, bool mute) const;
@@ -49,8 +49,8 @@ private:
 	bool active;
 	bool exclusive;
 
-	std::shared_ptr<RouteList const> routes_on;
-	std::shared_ptr<RouteList const> routes_off;
+	std::shared_ptr<StripableList const> routes_on;
+	std::shared_ptr<StripableList const> routes_off;
 
 	std::shared_ptr<std::list<std::string> > port_monitors;
 };
diff --git a/libs/ardour/control_group.cc b/libs/ardour/control_group.cc
index 5dba24c033..06e396b1c0 100644
--- a/libs/ardour/control_group.cc
+++ b/libs/ardour/control_group.cc
@@ -218,11 +218,11 @@ ControlGroup::set_group_value (std::shared_ptr<AutomationControl> control, doubl
 }
 
 void
-ControlGroup::fill_from_selection (CoreSelection const & sel, Evoral::Parameter const & p)
+ControlGroup::fill_from_selection_or_group (std::shared_ptr<Stripable> target, CoreSelection const & sel, Evoral::Parameter const & p, bool (RouteGroup::*group_predicate)() const)
 {
-	CoreSelection::StripableAutomationControls stripables;
+	StripableList sl;
 
-	sel.get_stripables (stripables);
+	sel.get_stripables_for_op (sl, target, group_predicate);
 
 	/* Very unfortunate that gain control is special cased. Routes do not
 	 * call ::add_control() for their gain control, but instead pass it to
@@ -231,24 +231,24 @@ ControlGroup::fill_from_selection (CoreSelection const & sel, Evoral::Parameter
 
 	switch (p.type()) {
 	case GainAutomation:
-		for (auto & s : stripables) {
-			std::shared_ptr<AutomationControl> ac = s.stripable->gain_control ();
+		for (auto & s : sl) {
+			std::shared_ptr<AutomationControl> ac = s->gain_control ();
 			if (ac) {
 				add_control (ac, true);
 			}
 		}
 		break;
 	case TrimAutomation:
-		for (auto & s : stripables) {
-			std::shared_ptr<AutomationControl> ac = s.stripable->trim_control ();
+		for (auto & s : sl) {
+			std::shared_ptr<AutomationControl> ac = s->trim_control ();
 			if (ac) {
 				add_control (ac, true);
 			}
 		}
 		break;
 	default:
-		for (auto & s : stripables) {
-			std::shared_ptr<AutomationControl> ac = s.stripable->automation_control (p, true);
+		for (auto & s : sl) {
+			std::shared_ptr<AutomationControl> ac = s->automation_control (p, true);
 			if (ac) {
 				add_control (ac, true);
 			}
diff --git a/libs/ardour/selection.cc b/libs/ardour/selection.cc
index 52ecd63356..27ed6421c7 100644
--- a/libs/ardour/selection.cc
+++ b/libs/ardour/selection.cc
@@ -613,3 +613,41 @@ CoreSelection::selected () const
 	Glib::Threads::RWLock::ReaderLock lm (_lock);
 	return _stripables.size();
 }
+
+void
+CoreSelection::get_stripables_for_op (std::shared_ptr<StripableList> sl, std::shared_ptr<Stripable> target, bool (RouteGroup::*group_predicate)() const) const
+{
+	return get_stripables_for_op (*sl.get(), target, group_predicate);
+}
+
+void
+CoreSelection::get_stripables_for_op (StripableList& sl, std::shared_ptr<Stripable> target, bool (RouteGroup::*group_predicate)() const) const
+{
+	if (_stripables.empty()) {
+		std::shared_ptr<Route> r (std::dynamic_pointer_cast<Route> (target));
+
+		if (r) {
+			RouteGroup* rg = r->route_group();
+
+			if (rg && rg->is_active() && (rg->*group_predicate)()) {
+				for (auto & r : *rg->route_list()) {
+					sl.push_back (r);
+				}
+			} else {
+				sl.push_back (target);
+			}
+
+		} else {
+			/* Base is not a route, use it and it alone */
+			sl.push_back (target);
+		}
+
+	} else {
+		StripableAutomationControls sc;
+		get_stripables (sc);
+
+		for (auto & s : sc) {
+			sl.push_back (s.stripable);
+		}
+	}
+}
diff --git a/libs/ardour/session_rtevents.cc b/libs/ardour/session_rtevents.cc
index b9f2b3abbe..9f3d01cd8b 100644
--- a/libs/ardour/session_rtevents.cc
+++ b/libs/ardour/session_rtevents.cc
@@ -130,25 +130,25 @@ Session::rt_set_controls (std::shared_ptr<WeakControlList> cl, double val, Contr
 void
 Session::prepare_momentary_solo (SoloMuteRelease* smr, bool exclusive, std::shared_ptr<Route> route)
 {
-	std::shared_ptr<RouteList> routes_on (new RouteList);
-	std::shared_ptr<RouteList> routes_off (new RouteList);
+	std::shared_ptr<StripableList> routes_on (new StripableList);
+	std::shared_ptr<StripableList> routes_off (new StripableList);
 	std::shared_ptr<RouteList const> routes = get_routes();
 
-	for (auto const& i : *routes) {
+	for (auto const & r : *routes) {
 #ifdef MIXBUS
-		if (route && (0 == route->mixbus()) != (0 == i->mixbus ())) {
+		if (route && (0 == route->mixbus()) != (0 == r->mixbus ())) {
 			continue;
 		}
 #endif
-		if (i->soloed ()) {
-			routes_on->push_back (i);
+		if (r->soloed ()) {
+			routes_on->push_back (r);
 		} else if (smr) {
-			routes_off->push_back (i);
+			routes_off->push_back (r);
 		}
 	}
 
 	if (exclusive) {
-		set_controls (route_list_to_control_list (routes_on, &Stripable::solo_control), false, Controllable::UseGroup);
+		set_controls (stripable_list_to_control_list (routes_on, &Stripable::solo_control), false, Controllable::UseGroup);
 	}
 
 	if (smr) {
diff --git a/libs/ardour/solo_mute_release.cc b/libs/ardour/solo_mute_release.cc
index 0c8dd9cede..e6c5876966 100644
--- a/libs/ardour/solo_mute_release.cc
+++ b/libs/ardour/solo_mute_release.cc
@@ -40,20 +40,20 @@ SoloMuteRelease::set_exclusive (bool e)
 }
 
 void
-SoloMuteRelease::set (std::shared_ptr<Route> r)
+SoloMuteRelease::set (std::shared_ptr<Stripable> r)
 {
-	std::shared_ptr<RouteList> rl (new RouteList);
+	std::shared_ptr<StripableList> sl (new StripableList);
 	if (active) {
-		rl->push_back (r);
-		routes_on = rl;
+		sl->push_back (r);
+		routes_on = sl;
 	} else {
-		rl->push_back (r);
-		routes_off = rl;
+		sl->push_back (r);
+		routes_off = sl;
 	}
 }
 
 void
-SoloMuteRelease::set (std::shared_ptr<RouteList const> rl)
+SoloMuteRelease::set (std::shared_ptr<StripableList const> rl)
 {
 	if (active) {
 		routes_on = rl;
@@ -63,7 +63,7 @@ SoloMuteRelease::set (std::shared_ptr<RouteList const> rl)
 }
 
 void
-SoloMuteRelease::set (std::shared_ptr<RouteList const> on, std::shared_ptr<RouteList const> off)
+SoloMuteRelease::set (std::shared_ptr<StripableList const> on, std::shared_ptr<StripableList const> off)
 {
 	routes_on = on;
 	routes_off = off;
@@ -79,11 +79,11 @@ void
 SoloMuteRelease::release (Session* s, bool mute) const
 {
 	if (mute) {
-		s->set_controls (route_list_to_control_list (routes_off, &Stripable::mute_control), 0.0, exclusive ? Controllable::NoGroup : Controllable::UseGroup);
-		s->set_controls (route_list_to_control_list (routes_on,  &Stripable::mute_control), 1.0, exclusive ? Controllable::NoGroup : Controllable::UseGroup);
+		s->set_controls (stripable_list_to_control_list (routes_off, &Stripable::mute_control), 0.0, exclusive ? Controllable::NoGroup : Controllable::NoGroup);
+		s->set_controls (stripable_list_to_control_list (routes_on,  &Stripable::mute_control), 1.0, exclusive ? Controllable::NoGroup : Controllable::NoGroup);
 	} else {
-		s->set_controls (route_list_to_control_list (routes_off, &Stripable::solo_control), 0.0, exclusive ? Controllable::NoGroup : Controllable::UseGroup);
-		s->set_controls (route_list_to_control_list (routes_on,  &Stripable::solo_control), 1.0, exclusive ? Controllable::NoGroup : Controllable::UseGroup);
+		s->set_controls (stripable_list_to_control_list (routes_off, &Stripable::solo_control), 0.0, exclusive ? Controllable::NoGroup : Controllable::NoGroup);
+		s->set_controls (stripable_list_to_control_list (routes_on,  &Stripable::solo_control), 1.0, exclusive ? Controllable::NoGroup : Controllable::NoGroup);
 
 		if (port_monitors && s->monitor_out ()) {
 			s->engine().monitor_port().set_active_monitors (*port_monitors);